Rewiring the Leader's Brain: How Healing Past Trauma Creates Business Innovation
Host: Kumar Dattatreyan, The Meridian Point
Guest: Dr. Ron Stotts, Transformational Executive Coach
Kumar: Hi, everyone. Kumar Dattatreyan here with The Meridian Point, and I am really pleased to have Dr. Ron Stotts on our show today. He's a transformational executive coach who helps leaders achieve higher levels of consciousness and effectiveness. After his own journey of transformation following his service in the Marine Corps, Dr. Stotts has spent decades combining ancient wisdom with modern neuroscience to help executives and entrepreneurs reach their highest potential. As a three-time best-selling author with a PhD in psychology, he's guided countless leaders to create more conscious and more caring organizations while achieving remarkable business results. We all need more conscious and caring organizations to work for and people to work with. So without further ado, let me bring Dr. Stotts on stage. Hi there. It's great to have you on the show.
Dr. Stotts: Good. Glad to be here. Thanks.
Kumar: You're welcome. Okay. So I'm going to start with our first question. You had a profound personal transformation after your service in the Marine Corps. How did that experience help shape your approach to transformational leadership?
Dr. Stotts: Well, the significance of that experience was that I had kind of grown up as the all-American kid in America. On that rifle range, they threw up a human silhouette in place of the target that I'd been shooting at for a while. My little nineteen-year-old mind realized that I was becoming really expert at killing people, not just shooting targets. That rocked my world in the deepest way I think it's ever happened. It was a moment where I realized that I was really the product of what my parents wanted me to be, what society felt I should be, rather than really knowing who I was and what I wanted to be. And so that really became my journey. My work now is to help people reconnect and become more self-aware and emotionally intelligent so that they can be the confident, authentic leader that they're meant to be.
Kumar: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. So I suppose that in order to help an organization transform, yourself must transform first. Is that sort of the premise of the work that you do with people?
Dr. Stotts: That is it. Yeah. A lot of people want me to work with their teams rather than themselves initially. And it just doesn't work that way because then they're not going to support all the transformation that's going on. That inner transformation really allows you to understand who you are and what you're capable of, and you can really lead from a place of confidence rather than fear, a place that really brings out the best in everyone, rather than that old style, top-down authoritative leadership that really controlled and limited everybody.
Kumar: Yeah. And what do you say to people when they say, "Well, I don't have time for that. I need to fix my teams. I know where the problems are, and just go fix the issues. It's these people doing the work."
Dr. Stotts: And that's the biggest problem I see in leadership today. All the problems and solutions—they look outside of themselves for all of that. And really, that's not where the answer is. The answers they're looking for are within themselves. So it's really, you know, you start asking questions about the challenges they're having, and it doesn't take long before the leaders, the CEOs, the top echelon, begin to recognize, "Oh, it's not an outer issue. It's an inner issue that's being reflected in my employees and my mindset and really what I'm able to do."
Kumar: Yeah, that definitely makes sense to me. I'm just curious, how do you scale that if you're working one leader at a time? Or is there an approach that you apply where you can coach multiple people to discover the things that hold them back?
Dr. Stotts: Well, you know, the truth is, you hit the weak link in this work. I do work with the top, and that allows them to literally transform their life and leadership and relationships with their family and all. But then it's like, okay, how do you bring in all their teams and their C-suites? Sometimes the CEO sends in several of their C-suite executives to do the deeper work, but it's really not something that you can say everybody has to do because it's very deep work. It is transformational, and some people are really ready to make a little shift but not such a significant shift.
So you bring a different style of awareness training. You bring in more awareness about who they are in terms of what challenges they're having, what's sabotaging their life on a regular basis. You bring in conversations that allow them to really enjoy talking about it rather than feeling threatened by it. And that allows them, in time, to look a little deeper and a little deeper. But yeah, you have to get the top people committed, and then the others will follow.
Kumar: That makes sense to me. So if you change the person at the top that's making the decisions, that's leading and guiding and coaching the people that report to him or her, then chances are that style of leadership is going to permeate through the organization organically. It may take a long time, but certainly, it would be a far better approach than just changing the teams and expecting the organization to change.
Dr. Stotts: Yeah. And, you know, the truth is, I was working with a fellow—probably first worked with him intensely back in 2020. For a year and a half, we were making some huge transformations. And then we started talking less and less. But he flew me down to the Bay Area to prepare him for the big launch that he's about to go through and some personal things that he's working with. And we were talking about it, and he says, "You know, most people got excited about it. Most people felt like it was a supportive thing for everybody and really a great chance for them to grow and learn and become a better leader themselves, but there were people in the organization that just had no interest in growing." And I mean, just factually, they were able to say that. And so they left the organization. And that's really what you have to do—let go of anybody not willing to play.
Kumar: Yeah, that's true. In my experience, I've seen that to be a fact that not everyone is aligned with the goals of the transformation or the methods by which they are undertaken. And, to be honest, most leaders don't think they need to change. And so transformations have very limited success because of that. Where it is more successful is where the leaders participate in that change and change along with the people that are the doers, if you will. If you think of leaders as deciders and the people that do the work as the doers.
Dr. Stotts: I remember back in the eighties, I was helping AT&T through their divestiture from a monopoly to four profit organizations. I was traveling all over, working with different level leaders from the very top on down. Towards about a year into that, all the programs were developed and everybody was excited about what we're offering, what we're going to be doing with everybody. It turns out that the top three people, as excited as they were about it, they wanted to water it down so much that it just became ludicrous to even offer. They were so attached to their old control and limiting ways that I just backed out of it, and I just said, "Well, it's not going to work if we do it this way."
Kumar: That's telling that people may say they want to do something, but then when it actually comes down to doing the work, personal change and personal transformation is a lot of work, and not everyone is ready for that.
Dr. Stotts: Yeah, I mean, for most, it becomes this great adventure. They have a lot of trepidation as they begin to enter it, but soon it becomes—they recognize, "Oh, I'm just getting to know myself better, getting to understand what's holding me back and how to heal these things." And it empowers, but for others, you're right. It's just not a comfortable transition.
Kumar: So, I mean, the title of this episode is "Rewiring the Leader's Brain" and sort of recognizing past trauma that may hold you back. Maybe you can go into a little detail as to how the program works to rewire someone's brain, if you will.
Dr. Stotts: Yeah, piece of cake. It's really a matter of people coming in with a particular mindset, belief systems, traditional ways of thinking about things. And as they begin to understand how people are responding to that, as they begin to recognize, "Oh, that's why people aren't comfortable with me is because I'm not really able to be compassionate or emotionally connected to what's going on with them. I'm worried more about their performance than I am about enhancing their leadership qualities."
So, it's just really a matter of people recognizing that as they heal, as they become empowered, their focus is less on their fears from childhood about being accepted and loved and thought of in certain ways. It becomes more about how to care for others. That's one thing I see in the work—people come in really to take care of themselves and to heal themselves, to better themselves, to make more money, to do whatever it is they want to do. And that certainly is always accomplished, but I watch it, really without exception. I see them then also begin to care more about others, and that includes their own family. Their relationships with their kids and their partner are significantly enhanced, and the way they're taking care of others is bringing out the best in them. As they bring out the best in others, people start trusting and feeling more comfortable and being more collaborative and cooperative. That, of course, results in greater productivity and profits, which is, you know, if you're in business, you want to make money. So this is not about just being in a win-win and supportive environment. It's about how you become—all the research shows, and I certainly say to my clients, that there's at least a 20 percent increase in productivity and profits, and oftentimes much, much more than that.
Kumar: That's astounding. And that's just by working with one leader. It can often be that case because it trickles down and out because they're treating people differently, and those people become more valuable leaders.
Dr. Stotts: It's like, you know, I remember I was walking in the park the other day with my wife, and a flock of Canadian geese flew over in that classic V shape. And she was sharing with me that they can go further each day because of that V shape, whereas the single goose would be exhausted going anywhere near that far. And that's really what happens in the work. I see people really become more integrated and whole within themselves. And so they're much more effective. They're literally accessing new levels of thinking. And the brain is literally rewired for higher levels of thinking and more rapid, agile mindsets that develop.
And as the whole team starts to work in that collectively conscious way, they're just working more effectively. And that, of course, results in more productivity, and that results in better profits. Everybody is looking for how to make this better so everybody can contribute from wherever they are in that organization.
Kumar: So I suppose that you are pretty selective in whom you work with, right? They have to be at a high enough level to have the kind of impact that a CEO or a founder or president or someone like that would have in changing their organization. Is that true? You're selective?
Dr. Stotts: Well, you have to be. I know a lot of people think they're interviewing me, but it's really a two-way street when I'm talking with somebody initially. If they aren't willing to look more deeply at themselves, if they aren't comfortable with the processes, then there's no point. I mean, you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make them drink kind of thing. It's just a waste of their time and mine if we're not actually going to go on this journey together.
Kumar: Right. And so when working with a leader, when you talk to them and you speak to them and you say, "Okay, what do you want to accomplish?" and they say, "I want my company to make more money. I want to make more money. I want to be more happy." And they buy into your program knowing that there's going to be a lot of personal transformation work. How long does it typically take for them to start reaping the rewards, if you will, of the work they do with you?
Dr. Stotts: I would say generally in the first couple of weeks, they get a realization of how significant the work is going to be and how much it will transform their life. Within a month, they oftentimes are beginning to really shift how they're shifting their leadership, they're shifting their perspective, they're shifting their communication. Generally within two months, you're seeing a significant shift. They're restructuring their organization, coming into their leadership from a whole different attitude. They're recognizing that, and people are appreciating that and responding to that.
To fully integrate it, it might take another nine months, but that's not anywhere near as in-depth. That's just really applying what they've learned in that first two months and continuing the process. The truth is, they're rewiring the brain, and that next nine months is just a matter of continuing that process and giving them exercises and understandings of how to continue that rewiring process.
So they're going—most of them will come in with this left-brain logical dominance. When they were kids, they got congratulated and loved and attention for being smart, and that got them into the right schools, that got them into the right jobs. But as they get into those new positions, they recognize, "Geez, I'm missing something here. I don't have the self-awareness and emotional intelligence to really bring a team together, to bring out the best in others, to really be compassionate and empathetic enough and be vulnerable enough and open enough so that I can connect with people, allowing them to feel safe."
It's just all of these things—they become really an expert at playing whack-a-mole, basically. They're very good at putting out fires and coming up with quick solutions and all that type of thing. But I see the problem is, once they really transform their life, most of those immediacies dissipate because they're a result of their old style of leadership.
Kumar: This sounds amazing and wonderful. I'm just thinking... And maybe I just need to go through your program and see how it works because, and I know we talked about it, I've just been playing the whack-a-mole game pretty much as you described it myself. But I'm just curious for large—I don't know to what size companies you're currently working with and the leaders in those companies. In a large organization that's either publicly or privately held, you have, if it's publicly held, then you have shareholders and you've got a CEO. Unless you're working with that CEO, it takes, it would seem to me that it would take a while for that to trickle down into the organization. And I'm curious, are you working with this individual individually to sort of become more aware of the fears and things that hold them back? Are you also working with them in the work context, observing how they behave and providing guidance, advice on how they can improve their relationships with their directs and providing advice on business transformation needs, things like that?
Dr. Stotts: Well, the truth is, I've been doing this long enough that if I know them, I know how they're treating other people. And yes, I do get some 360-degree feedback and that type of thing, but that's relatively minimal because I do understand where they're coming from. I do understand their fears and inadequacies. I understand what needs to be healed so that those things aren't playing out in the work area.
And so that quite literally happens very quickly. I mean, in a couple of months, you've really gone through the core, which is you've quit looking outside for love and acceptance that you've wanted since you were an infant, to looking within yourself and finding it. And it's in that self-acceptance that you really—that's where the brain restructures itself because you've got an entirely different mindset. Rather than the amygdala controlling the overall organization and expression of the brain, the forebrain begins to develop and takes over as the conscious CEO of the mind. That has just a bigger picture—the left and right brain have now come together, and they're working together as a team. The right being more spontaneous, emotionally aware, bigger picture concepts. The left brain now not working on its own with just informational base, but that bigger picture sees the optimal path to the success you're looking for.
And with that new forebrain development, you really see a much bigger picture in terms of others and organizations. And so you're thinking, you're just accessing higher levels of thinking. You're seeing things that you wouldn't have seen. You're seeing, rather than challenges, you're seeing opportunities and taking those.
I mean, just recently in a meeting with a fellow, he explained his perspectives and why he was so successful in several of the areas that he's working with. He's got five, actually five international organizations, all in nine figures. And the success that he's experiencing now, this is about probably three years later, is just so phenomenal that he just had to kind of step back and go, "What's that all about?" And he sees that it's all the result of that initial shift that he was able to go through with us.
Kumar: Yes, wonderful. It seems like it's—I don't know, it's overusing the word, but really transformational for the individual. And that result is manifested in how that person, that individual treats others, treats their family. And of course, that is manifested by how those others treat the teams that they work with. You mentioned mindsets a lot. And in the work that I do, we talk a lot about growth versus fixed mindset. So in a way, at least the way I'm thinking about it is you're helping shift from a fixed mindset to a growth-oriented mindset.
Dr. Stotts: Very much so. And that's, I mean, that to me, that's the greatest gift that I can share with them—instead of stuttering through life from one comfort zone to another, that they really are going through life from a place of evolving and constantly evolving. It's kind of like the lobster who, every year, feels this particular niggle or discomfort and knows that it's time to go into their den and shed their shell so they can grow a new one so they can continue to grow and evolve. And that's true for us. There are all these indicators when we're having challenges and troubles in our lives. Those aren't bad things. Those are just indicators that we're evolving.
And as people go through this work, they understand the process of evolving, so they immediately start taking care of themselves in ways that allow them to evolve into that next level that they're ready for. And so it's a very rewarding process. I mean, the fellow, again, about three weeks ago now that I met with—he was ready to evolve into the next level. He was ready to do this big launch. And he had me come down to where he was and spend a couple of days with him, help him prepare for that. And the truth was, it was him having to let go of control on another level. He's really done well with it, he really has, but it was just on a whole other level. He had to learn to trust. He had to let go so that he could handle this expanded level of play that, as organizations, we're moving into.
Kumar: That's fascinating. Well, I'm going to shift to some other fun questions. You mentioned in our last conversation that you do a lot of meditation and mindfulness work yourself. What is your go-to mindfulness practice when you're feeling stressed?
Dr. Stotts: Well, I would have to say my most trusted advisor, best friend, spiritual teacher, however you want to look at it, is my breathing. My breathing really tells me everything. Use the breath to look deeper. You can use the breath to move into any level of consciousness you want to be in. So your level of consciousness determines how you see, experience, and react to everything that comes into your life. So if you're not understanding or able to handle something, or you're having a challenge with something coming into your life, it just means that you need to shift to another level of consciousness where you see it from a new perspective.
And breathing is what allows you to be able to do that quite easily, quite comfortably. And, you know, if you haven't done the deeper work, then you're not able to breathe in that way. They're very, very connected. Your ability to breathe and shift your mindset comes from having healed all of those past issues that kept you in that fixed mindset that you referred to.
So for me, I just notice my breathing. If I'm not breathing full and deep, then I'll shift to doing that. Oftentimes, my breathing at this point in my life—I noticed my breathing shifting before I'm even aware of something going on. And that allows me to always... I was talking to a bunch of coaches the other day, I'm developing a coaching program, and you know, the real secret to being a good coach, a good leader, really good at anything is, your only job in life is to really be able to breathe and be curious.
Breathing and being curious allows you to be present enough so that you're conscious enough to always see your best next option in any given circumstances that comes forward. And that always allows you to see not only your best next step, but it gives you the courage to take that step, the trust to take that step and know that the next step will be there too. And that's called living mindfully.
Kumar: Yeah, that's really fascinating. I do try to practice it, but I don't do it enough. But I love that insight that it's really just paying attention to your breath is enough to raise the awareness of the level of consciousness that maybe you're currently exhibiting, and one maybe that's not as useful to you, right? Because if you're anxious and your breath is shallow, then maybe the decisions you make will be based on fear or pressure or whatever it might be. Very fascinating insight. Thank you for sharing that.
Dr. Stotts: For me, the emotions, the feelings, all of those things are just indicators. They aren't good things or bad things. They're just indicators. They're like street signs. Slow down. Pay more attention here. Notice what's going on. If I'm stressing out, it's really a matter of feeling. And that's what emotional intelligence truly is. When you become emotionally comfortable with your own feelings, then you're more comfortable and aware of when emotional issues come into your life. You see them as just nothing but indicators, telling you, "Oh, there's an opportunity here. There's a growth opportunity here."
So I just breathe. I look deeper, find out what needs to be healed, acknowledge and heal that, and then evolve into the person who can handle whatever is in front of me. Really, it's just that simple once you get to that level of play.
Kumar: I love your definition of it. I truly do. I need to do some thinking about it and self-reflection for me and for the people that I work with and the people I coach and things like that.
Dr. Stotts: You know, I'm a sailor, and on a sailboat, there's two little threads on the forward part of the sail. And whoever is steering the boat is really watching those two threads. Those threads on the outside of the forward sail—if it's wiggling, then that tells you, "Oh, I need to come up into the wind a bit more." If the inside one's wiggling, it's like, "Oh, I need to fall off the wind a little bit more."
Our emotions and challenges in our life are nothing but those little telltales, those little indicators. And if you're watching those carefully and responding to them in an empowering way, not a reactive, fearful way, then you've got the subtle indicators that are going to make your life much easier and much more enjoyable.
Kumar: Right. We have a comment here from someone. Let's see what—"When you heal your trauma, you see why people are hurting and how you can show up for them directly or indirectly." This is from a CEO. I think it's been there for a little bit. I didn't see it until now, but absolutely, you know, I agree with that. I'm sure you would as well. So thank you for posting that, Rocio. I appreciate it. Anything that I haven't asked you, Dr. Stotts, that you'd like to share with this audience?
Dr. Stotts: Yeah, I mean, just find the courage to love and accept yourself. Find the courage to really dive in and discover who you truly are and what your capabilities are. Most people are so fear-oriented, they're not able to access their higher levels of thinking. So I understand why they're fearful. If you feel trapped and are at the effect of things and you don't know what to do and you can't come up with the thought, that could be scary.
But as you heal this backlog and become more present, and they're able to breathe into and through whatever's coming into their life, literally, those challenges become opportunities. I heard that enough when I was younger and went like, "Yeah, right." But it's true. Those challenges absolutely are just opportunities for growth, opportunities for you to see what's your best next step and take that from an empowered, confident place, not from a fearful, inadequate place.
Kumar: I totally agree with that. And I'm sure the audience, the live audience and whoever's going to be watching this and listening to this on our podcast later—how will they get in touch with you, Dr. Stotts?
Dr. Stotts: I think the simplest way is just to go to my website at ronstotts.com. And, you know, there's free materials there. There's YouTube, there's blogs, there's all the miscellaneous information, but there's also information on the programs that I offer. And, you know, there's a lot of benefits for them that doesn't have to cost them any money or take any time. They can pick those up for free.
Kumar: Okay. Very good. And I think I do have in the show notes for this episode, your information. So for anyone that's watching that wants to learn more, please visit Dr. Stotts' site. You can certainly leave comments in the show itself, and I'll relay it over to Dr. Stotts. So thank you for watching. Thank you for joining, Dr. Stotts. I really enjoyed our conversation.
Dr. Stotts: Yeah. Well, thank you. And I hope to stay in touch with you.
Kumar: All right. Very well. I look forward to it then. Take care. Bye-bye.
Dr. Stotts: Take care.
Connect with Dr. Ron Stotts:
Website: www.ronstotts.com
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ron.stotts.50/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dr-ron-stotts-14143236/
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@dr.ronstotts
